Biggest Differences Between This Year and Last
by higgyhoops12 on Nov 7, 2010 10:24 AM MST
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PrintI know it's only been six games, but I was thinking about it and watching the Nuggets this year is much different than watching the Nuggets last year. To me, last year Nuggets games seemed more like, "The Melo Show" with Chauncey consistently averaging 20 PPG and with JR having an amazing game every once in a while. Our front-court seemed frail and weak, because it was. Our bench was weak besides Lawson and sometime JR.
This year is completely different for me. Melo still takes his shots, but Chauncey doesn't need to do as much since Al Harrington has come to town. Arron Afflalo has emerged as a key piece of our team. In my eyes, our front-court seems to be the strongest that it's been in a while. Melvin Ely and Shelden Williams have shown promise. Also, with Harrington coming to town, our bench is much stronger. Instead of JR's inconsistency, we've found a solid player to come off the bench and score 15+ points per game, at much higher percentages.
Here's some comparisons between Melvin Ely and Shelden Williams this year, vs. K-Mart and Birdman last year. I'm going to compare their stats per 30 minutes. Obviously, I'm basing K-Mart and Birdman's statistics off of last year)
Points per 30 minutes:
Melvin Ely: 5.8 (56%)
Shelden Williams: 9.2 (49%)
Kenyon Martin: 10.1 (46%)
Chris Andersen: 7.9 (57%)
Rebounds per 30 minutes:
Melvin Ely: 8.0 (2.2 offensive, 5.8 defensive)
Shelden Williams: 10.5 (3.8 offensive, 6.7 defensive)
Kenyon Martin: 8.2 (2.1 offensive, 6.1 defensive)
Chris Anderson: 8.5 (2.6 offensive, 5.9 defensive)
Blocks per 30 minutes:
Melvin Ely: 1.3
Shelden Williams: 0.6
Kenyon Martin: 0.9
Chris Anderson: 2.5
Steals per 30 minutes:
Melvin Ely: 0.9
Shelden Williams: 0.6
Kenyon Martin: 1.1
Chris Andersen: 0.7
So overall, Shelden Williams and Melvin Ely would average 15 points at 52.5%, 18.5 rebounds (6 offensive, 12.5 defensive), 1.9 blocks, and 1.5 steals.
Kenyon Martin and Chris Anderson would average 18 PPG at 51.5%, 16.7 rebounds (4.7 offensive, 12 defensive), 3.6 blocks, and 1.8 steals.
Which would you prefer? Also, consider the salaries. Williams and Ely combined are $2,139,018, whereas K-Mart and Bird's combined are $20,487,454.
I personally would rather have Ely and Williams, but who knows. Maybe Martin will come back and play harder since he's looking for a new contract at the end of this year. Also, Bird's knee was injured for most of the year last year, so maybe he'll come back to his 2008-2009 form. It will all be interesting to see what happens when Bird and K-Mart come back. I personally wouldn't mind trading K-Mart at the trade deadline. I can't believe I'm saying this, but this is the first time in a while that I feel like we have an abundance of big men.
I also think that we should get rid of JR. He's a cancer to the team. His inconsistency is unacceptable, and we've found a replacement for him.
Any thoughts on the abundance of big men or biggest differences between this year and last? Please share
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i just think blocks are overrated
i prefer shelden’s D over bird’s D. shelden stays infront of his man and blocks out. when bird comes back, i hope we still give shelden minutes. bird should only be an energy guy, his fundamentals are FUCKIN terrible.
let's go nuggets! who u wit?
They didn't used to be
I think the whole “Birdman” thing went to his head (or should I say neck), and that caused him to be a one dimensional player.
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Agree with both
I think that We should give Birdman the benefit of the doubt as he clearly played injured for much of last year. With that being said — i like the idea of Birdman not getting starter’s minutes and keeping him as more of the “energy guy” and difference maker that he was during during the 2009 playoff runs. I would say 15-18 minutes would be perfect.
by Boulder_Matthew on Nov 8, 2010 3:18 PM MST up reply actions
Harrington is by far the biggest difference
we are just a better overall TEAM this year and it shows. I’m not sure why you want to trade K-mart/JR at this point. What do you honestly expect to get in return? What needs does this team have? The only glaring need I see, is keeping Melo a Nugget. Trading away 2 of the longest tenured Nuggets isn’t gonna help that need. Since the big FA summer has already passed no teams are looking to shed all their contracts to try and get lebron. For an expiring we are more likely to get an aging former all-star with a bad contract. Exactly what we don’t need, especially if Melo leaves.
I believe we should roll with what we got, including Melo. If we lose him for late 1st round picks so be it. We have a great team that is capable of winning it all. Having 6 capable bigs is a nice change, let’s enjoy it. But let’s be honest, while Ely has played well he is nothing more than this years Tacos when K-mart and Bird come back. I hope and expect that Shelden will keep his starting job. He’s earned it and fits well with our starters. K-mart can be used situationally. Basically we can use him as our thug. If a guy is hot, send in K-mart to harrass him and put him on the floor. I think K-mart could thrive as an defensive energy enforcer off the bench. Similar situation with Bird, but I think he can play the more traditional backup 5 role. Harrington is the huge wildcard and will allow GK to get creative with lineups. Harrington really makes the biggest difference with this team. Lawson, JR, Harrington, K-mart, Bird? Gotta be the best defensive bench in the league and still has 2 guys capable of 30pts on a given night.
You can't bench K-Mart when healthy
When he’s coming back from injury, the first few games – sure. But let’s not get too ahead of ourselves, K-Mart is a VITAL part of this team and a much better player than Shelden. No way he comes off the bench when fully healthy.
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When is KMart actually going to be healthy?
With this new attitude and players we’ve added. The Nuggets are still doing pretty good. How would’ve Wednesday’s game went with Nene in the lineup? We would’ve taken the Mavs to the woodshed.
KMart (When healthy) has done a lot of great things but his injury history speaks for itself. Unless he wants to come back for a BAE, we let him walk or trade him for that big we need in the playoffs (and maybe to get Melo to stay which is still pie in the sky at this point)
Quitter's People United Member #35
I'm not talkin about anytime after this year
For all I care we can let K-Mart walk, (in fact I’d probabaly prefer that) but I’m talkin this season when he comes back he needs to start.
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I think people are overracting to Shelden
Yes, he’s played well in K-Mart’s absence, but he has nowhere near the tools/attitude K-Mart has to do damage come playoff time. If it weren’t for K-Mart guarding West and Dirk there’s no way we win those two series as easily as we do. K-Mart’s bigger, stronger, faster, can jump higher, and is more fierce, nasty and disrupting than Shelden ever will be. That’s what you need in the playoffs. Sheleden will still be a great role player off the bench, but you just can’t start him with K-Mart healhty.
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i'm one of the biggest k-mart supporters around
but you’re overlooking one fact. Shelden is a better rebounder than K-mart. That is really what we need most with our starting unit. Depending on who’s hot to start the game, K-mart can come in be physical and aggressive with them and not worry about foul trouble. The biggest advantage he has is he can guard the 3,4 or 5 position. I think we need to rethink his role to keep him healthy and use him in shorter bursts where his intensity will be more effective.
If their total minutes are equal or even if Shelden gets less minutes than K-mart, I don’t really care. But I think Shelden should start as he fits better in that role and not off the bench. I have a feeling Shelden will be much less effective coming off the bench.
Sadly, I might agree.
Not happy about it, but I do think you’re right about Shelden’s confidence waning if he gets yanked from the starting role.
I sort of agree
I don’t necessarily think Shelden should start when everyone’s healthy, but his rebounding has had a huge impact so far, and it’s something we’ve been somewhat starved for in recent years. It’s definitely added a new dimension on both ends of the court. I’d almost forgotten what it’s like to have a big that rebounds consistently. Thanks, Landlord!
As much of an impact as it has had, I’m not sure I take his rebounding over either Nene, or KMart… also remember that KMart is a much better rebounder than Nene. The way Nene’s been playing, you can make a pretty good argument for a Shelden/KMart frontcourt.
I’m actually a big Nene supporter, and I really hope he gets his game going when he gets back.
I still don't think we can make that assesment
that Sheldes is a better rebounder than K-Mart off of 6 career starts. But I do agree on limiting K-Mart’s minutes.
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he's definitely better fundamentally
he boxes out soundly and actually gets in position for offensive rebounds rather than trying to fly in for put-back dunks. I love K-mart and I think losing him was one of the main reasons we fell apart last year. I just think Shelden’s slow and steady skill set fits with our starting 5 where rebounding is a big need. Being fundamentally sound tends to us down and helps the whole team start off in rhythm. K-mart is a firecracker and can trigger huge runs for us, but we’ve also seen him lose his cool and send the whole team into a dysfunctional tailspin. This is why I think K-mart will be suited to shorter spurts off the bench where his toughness and energy can be best utilized.
Keep JR and Kenyon
Re-sign (not resign, everybody) Kenyon at a discounted rate and show some confidence in JR. I can’t believe you wrote you want to trade JR after last night’s line of 11-6-5-5 and 0 TO’s. That is a serious stat line for a bench player and it’s time Karl starts giving him some rope. Keep Ely, Bargain Bin (Williams) and Melo and roll the dice. This team is definitely special.
Don't forget
0 TO’s the night before also.
Maybe I do have the right.... wait, what's that stuff??? - Homer Simpson
QPU #381
He's averaging .8 turnovers per game
That’s better than any Nugget getting over 20 minutes per game by a descent margin. In fact, in terms of rotational players in the entire NBA, JR ranks 17th in least amount of turnovers per game.
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Al is a beast
he won’t be in the all-star game but he has all-star potential. He wasn’t lying about his commitment to D and is a guy who can average over 15 and 5. We picked him up w/o losing anything so it was a huge addition. Then our role players are better than last year and it’s showing.
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Funny thing is JR might
Have something to say about Harrington winning top 6th man. JR could finish in top 5 as well.
Still don’t understand the JR hate, he is playing well and we want to get rid of him? He is one of the main reasons we won that game in Dallas.
Believe me KMart and Bird are upgrades over Williams and Ely. Nice to have them as insurance though. Maybe even play Williams off the bench to keep KMart’s minutes down.
Gotta love the haterz. Keep that hate a comin'
by JR15 on Nov 7, 2010 12:09 PM MST via mobile up reply actions
i think it could be beneficial
for JR not to be gunning for 6th man of the year this year so just plays within the game. I’m thrilled he hasn’t turned the ball over in 2 games. ~10 pts and 0 TOs is exactly what I want from him. Anything more is just a bonus.
+1 about JR
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I don't think you can just look at stats though...
don’t get me wrong I absolutely love what Shelden is bringing this year and Melvin the last 2 games, but they don’t have the same impact that Bird and Kenyon do. First of all Shelden is a much a better rebounder and shooter than both Kenyon and Bird, but they’re both better on defense and more explosive. I don’t think it matters because at one point we should have all of them with Al and this team will be the best in the NBA!
Even better than your Heat hvino?
Jk… The funny thing about the Heat is that Melo has a better head to head record vs. LBJ, DWade, and Bosh. Maybe with them combined he will have a better record against them lol.
Btw DWade still hasn’t won in the Pepsi center and we have beaten the Heat 9 of the last 10 games. Let’s keep them as our bitch and make them pay for overlooking us. (Dwades ad referred to LA and Boston as their threats, let’s make them think we are a part of that group as well).
Gotta love the haterz. Keep that hate a comin'
by JR15 on Nov 7, 2010 2:41 PM MST via mobile up reply actions
Bird is an awful defender
He goes for the pump fake every time, which I am sure is in every scouting report.
WOW
Does everyone hate bird now? It wasn’t long ago we all signed a petition to bring the birdman back. And as far as kmart his still our best defender. What we did to bring in Sheldon and ely was out of need not to replace. So this thought of not needing bird and Kenyon is ludicris and pisses me off that people think we should just discard them like yesterdays trash.
by tknuckle on Nov 7, 2010 3:18 PM MST via mobile reply actions
I agree
It would be nice to see if Karl plays Williams of the bench for 10 min a game (near the end of 2nd quarter, and spot minutes in 4th).
Forbes also deserves spot PT. We will see Karl’s rotation when everybody is healthy.
Gotta love the haterz. Keep that hate a comin'
by JR15 on Nov 7, 2010 3:23 PM MST via mobile up reply actions
so far we havent seen either Bird or Kmart this year
Who to say if they can play at a high level now after going under the knife.
Of course they likely can still go, but Williams is MUCH younger than both of them which is important because he can still get better and learn more. With Bird and Kmart they’ll bring what they bring, they’re not gettin any better.
by InboundingLobPass on Nov 7, 2010 3:31 PM MST via mobile up reply actions
+1
I still like Bird a lot. He’s a huge energy guy and is great for the Nuggets and the younger fans. If he could improve his man-to-man defense and rebounding he’d be set.
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I never signed nothin.
And those that did sign the petition would have preferred his signing be at a reasonable rate. Look, we all love (maybe not all) Birdman’s antics, but he is not an amazing basketball player. He needs to work on fundamentals and stop going for EVERY pump fake.
With Shelden Williams' game I see 95% of KMart's game for a minimum contract. Why re-sign KMart; knowing his age and injury history?
I originally thought he’s be a shorter Petro, but his 1 on 1 defense is excellent and has a dead reliable 13 footer that KMart wishes he had.
Plus he’s only 27! Still has lots of years left, if he keeps this up let’s re sign him and he can be a good part for years…
Quitter's People United Member #35
by CombatChuk on Nov 7, 2010 4:06 PM MST reply actions 1 recs
Also, Shelden is a young 27
Kmart has been a starter his whole career and shelden has been a benchwarmer.
Wow surprised by the poll
Al certainly is a big difference maker, but there’s a lot more too. The emergence of AAA, the improvement of Ty, the change in attitude, etc. I mentioned this is the post-game thread, but I feel the biggest difference between this year and last is our attitude. Maybe the new tech’s rule has something to do with it, but my guess is Karl is likely the biggest factor. We seem like we just look at the game differently. No matter how far behind we get, we’re never out if it and we have always made a comeback. That’s showing the heart of a champion, and that has been missing, forever it seems like. For once, I’m proud of this team. Even when we were “The Thuggets,” as much as I loved our team I was never proud of them. Now I feel like honored to call this team my favorite. Also the depth of our roster is key to this years success. We don’t have any weak links like AC, Petro or Tacos. This year our rotation is a constant flurry of punches towards the opposing team. Affalo deserves a lot of credit but so does our previous FO for bringing in Al. Those two guys have put our team into another gear that we’ve never, ever seen before. It’s certainly exciting.
The Goo Goo Dolls and Lady Gaga are going on tour together. The tour name: Goo Goo Gaga.
by GoldenNugget on Nov 7, 2010 4:27 PM MST reply actions 1 recs
Well said GN
If GK’s return had been on the poll, it would have gotten a lot of votes.
Man, when I see that team defence – what intensity! JR tensely crouched, Melo putting serious body on a much taller opponent, Ty fighting thru pick after pick like a demon, Al right up in Dirk’s face. The Mavs can really light ’em up, and we completely stifled them in the 4th. The DALLAS announcers kepy complimenting our defence.
It’s like “You wanna score against US? Go ahead and try.” Do I love it? Yes, indeed.
Concerning the bigs
Shelden and Bird are polar opposites. One is clunky looking but fundamentally very sound; the other flashy looking but fundamentally shaky. There is room for both, but Shelden’s solidity deserves more minutes, say 24 to Bird’s 16.
KMart is better than either of them when healthy, but I say cash him in. The need is for a legit long 5, and his expiring contract plus a draft pick might get us one.
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