Nuggets double-down with Graham?
Thanks to Chris Dempsey of the Denver Post we learned two things today: first, we can add Joey Graham's name to the list of players that Linas Kleiza was almost traded for. Second, Graham has all but locked up the 13th and perhaps final roster spot. Count me among those who are a bit confused and let's get into why ...
First things first ... obviously I'm not a front office expert and roster moves should be left to the guys who know what they are doing. The Nuggets did a great job last season plugging holes on the cheap and we should trust that once again they are making the right moves for the team. We'll soon find out how these moves pan out, as opening night is less than a fortnight away!
(I'll now put on my white wig and do a bit of judging ...)
I like the type of player that Joey Graham is ... a hard worker with a tough mentality. As George Karl points out in the Denver Post article on Graham, "There's a 'how we played' last year that I don't think any of us want to change," Karl said. "Joey has that Dahntay Jones personality. They are different players, going to do it in different ways. But from the standpoint of courage and toughness and the desire to defend, Joey has those personalities."
I appreciate the Joey Graham type of player. As a fan, I can relate more to the hard working guys as I assume I'd play the game the way the "Joey Grahams" of the NBA would. It's always important to have those roles players and perhaps Graham will give the Nuggets something they lacked last season ...
But don't the Nuggets already have that player on the roster and under contract? His name ... Renaldo Balkman.
Joey Graham: 6'7'' and 225 pounds.
Renaldo Balkman: 6'8'' and 208 pounds.
Joey Graham's career numbers: 17.4 minutes, 6.4 points, 3.1 rebounds, 48% shooting, 82% free throw, and 31.4% three pointers (43-137).
Renaldo Balkman's career numbers: 15 minutes, 4.4 points, 3.8 rebounds, 51.7% shooting, 53.6% free throw, and 17.4% three pointers (8-46).
If you judge these guys based off height, weight, and their career numbers ... you'll see they appear to be somewhat similar ... but the way in which the coaching staff plans on using the two could be vastly different. Karl has stated in the past that he likes to play Balkman at the power forward position, although many of us want to see 'Naldo get more minutes as Melo's backup at small forward. And from the Post's article it sounds like Karl plans on using Graham at shooting guard and at small forward (at least while J.R. Smith is serving his seven-game suspension to start the season.)
My hope is that if Graham does in fact make the team that it wont come at the cost of Balkman's minutes, but I have a feeling that, as Burgess Meredith once said in Grumpy Old Men: "You can wish in one hand and crap in the other, and see which gets filled first."
Readers of the old Pickaxe and Roll know that I wanted to see Balkman get more run last season. I like to track goofy stats like ... the Nuggets are 15-3 when Balkman played 20+ minutes a night and 21-6 when Balkman played 15+ minutes a night. I like to say that good things happen when Balkman is on the floor ... although I realize that the film might not always indicate my theory.
To compare ... the Raptors (33-49 last season) were 20-21 when Joey Graham played 20+ minutes a night last season. That's probably not a fair look at things because Graham wasn't on a team as good as the Nuggets (54-28), but you can say that when Graham played 20+ minutes he helped the team to 60.6% of their wins (and to 42.8% of their losses.)
So, who is Joey Graham? He's the former 16th overall pick of the Toronto Raptors from the 2005 NBA draft. He's 27 years old and wont be 28 until June 11, 2010. Graham played in 80 games his rookie season (2005-06) and averaged 19.8 minutes. In his second season (2006-07) he appeared in 79 games, but saw his minutes reduced to just 16.7 per game. In his third season, Graham appeared to lose the confidence of Sam Mitchell as he appeared in just 38 games and recorded 44 Did Not Play - Coach's Decisions (DNP-CDs) dropping his minutes to 8.7 per game.
But last season Graham, after head coach Sam Mitchell was fired the first week of December 2008, became part of the Raptors rotation again under new head coach Jay Triano. Through the first 13 games of the 2008-09 season (under Mitchell) Graham averaged just 6.3 minutes per game. But after that 13th game Graham saw his playing time increase to 21.6 minutes for the final three game of November, 21.6 minutes in December, 23.1 minutes in January, and 27 minutes in February. Then in March and April his playing time fell to roughly 17 minutes per game ... as the Raptors were probably auditioning some new players for the pending free-agent Graham's role.
This past offseason the Toronto Star reported that the Raptors chose not to offer a qualifying offer to Graham, thus making him an unrestricted free agent (exactly what the Nuggets did with Johan Petro.) The news of the non-qualifying offer on NBA.com noted that "He's (Graham) shown occasional flashes of usefulness during his Toronto tenure, but Raptors fans will mainly remember him as the guy former GM Mike Babcock drafted instead of Danny Granger."
So, is Graham another "coulda, woulda, shoulda" guy or will he prove to be a key role player for the Nuggets this season? On paper it would appear that he offers little in the way of big-time stats, but intangibles will be where this guy leaves his mark.
And with the news that Graham will probably fill the void as the teams' 13th player on the roster, that could signify the end of the James "Flight" White era in Denver. Karl has said he wants to carry more than the league minimum 13 players on the roster, so White may still find a home in Denver this year. I liked the idea of having White on the team. He felt like more of what Denver needed ... a guy to stretch the floor and hit the outside shot and a guy who could excite the crowd with some electrifying dunks, but he might be lacking on the defensive side. It seemed to me that the combination of White and Balkman made more sense than the combination of Graham and Balkman.
I hope that I'm proved wrong because I like what I'm hearing about Graham. Again, I like hard-nosed players that bring intangibles to a team that has enough weapons to hide the role players' flaws. Graham may have his draw-backs, but it sounds like he can make up for them in certain areas that this team needs.
For our sake and for Graham's ... let's hope we don't remember his time here as the guy our front office signed instead of Linas Kleiza or James White.
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I'm torn. It could go either way for me.
I dont know much about James White’s game other than he has crazy hops. So I’m intrigued and would love to see him get minutes in a Nuggets uniform. As far as Joey goes. Joey Graham is from my hometown and went to my rival high school (although when he was a senior, I was in eighth grade so I only got to see him play) so I’m always pulling for him and his brother to do good. I watched alot of his early games with the raptors and he can definitely help the nuggets out in a good way. I do like Balkman alot better tho and Joey shouldnt take his minutes.
James White
Is he really a good shooter? I remember reading somewhere that GK said White was like the poor man’s JR Smith. I think Balkman and Graham seem to be similar players, tough, good slasher, solid defender. If White is a shooter, that would bring another dimension to our team, which means someone on the bench could help stretch the floor when our starters are resting. If White really is sort of like JR Smith as a player, I think it would make more sense to have him on the bench for scoring purposes than to have 3 hard nosed defenders that play similar positions coming off the bench (Afflolo, Balkman, Graham), that aren’t great scorers.
White is an unproven NBA shooter ... from what I've seen of him his outside shot looks improved, but it's not "NBA tested"
White is more of a project while Graham is probably more of what this team needs. I wouldn’t be surprised to see White on an NBA roster this season though making some contributions …
Knicks? T-Wolves? A team like that …
Denver Stiffs.com: Defending the sovereignty of Nuggets Nation.
by Nate Timmons on Oct 15, 2009 5:08 PM MDT up reply actions
James White's jumper is overrated by all of you
Just because he went 3-5 from the 3-ball land in four games last season doesn’t mean anything. K-Mart began 2008-2009 shooting 6-9 from the 3-ball, and we all know how wonderful of a jump-shooter Kenyon is.
(vomits at the thought of K-Mart pulling up to shoot a long J)
"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." -John Elway
kobe bryant
add lebron james and brandon roy to the list. can a team ever have enough players and fouls to guard these guys. i think balkman can do a better job defending them and would like to see him get a chance to try. any team in the west wanting to go to the finals will need to go through the lakers. what balkman brings to the power forward spot is the same thing nene brings to center. they can out quick people. nene would have a hard time at power forward succeeding at what he does best at center. on defense at 2 guard he can excel but on offense is he a hack a shaq waiting to happen? graham’s contract is not gaurunteed until january. with jr’s suspension white can still be on the roster the first 7 games. depending how well denver plays during that time will determine the final roster.
pick up a calf every day pretty soon you will be picking up a cow
Graham at SG???
I hope not. He’s a forward, thru and thru.
Nice writeup Nate, but I gotta say, while the comparison of records when players log X number of minutes is a bit deceiving. Simply put, I just don’t think you can compare the lineups that these guys were playing in and say “well, he really made a difference” or vice versa. Joey Graham was inserted into a pretty weak squad.
Yes, I realize that and made a small mention of it with Graham contributing 60.6% of his teams wins ... while being on a lesser team.
Good point.
I think with Graham on the roster Karl will have the ability to juggle the lineups in a few crazy ways …
Denver Stiffs.com: Defending the sovereignty of Nuggets Nation.
by Nate Timmons on Oct 15, 2009 5:10 PM MDT up reply actions
Link between minutes and wins . . .
‘Course, it also stands to reason that when I guy is playing well he get more minutes and when that player is usually a marginal contributor, well, it tends to help the team win. I love when announcers stay things like when player X (third scoring option on a team) has 20 pts or more, the team is 16-4 or somthing like that. When I guy get 10 extra points and he isn’t the primary option that tends to help a lot.
Same thing with a bench role player, (I like Balkman), but (1) if he came in and got two turnovers, he sat the rest of night, hard to say if he would have helped out team on those night; (2) He was one of the last players on the bench, so he got to play when the nugs were blowing teams out. Not saying those are the only games he played high minutes in, but mins in blow-outs over Sac, GS, Min, Mem, etc are not the same as big minutes against the Lakers. As one of the last players on the bench his won-loss min/record benefits from a skewing towards those games.
The Nugs were 12-3 when Melo played less than 31 minutes . . .I don’t think that mean much either ’cept Melo plays less when the game is out of reach.
Joey is quicker than Balk, despite his higher weight.
Balk is a better rebounder.
"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." -John Elway
Which is why I called it "goofy stats" ...
Denver Stiffs.com: Defending the sovereignty of Nuggets Nation.
by Nate Timmons on Oct 19, 2009 8:43 AM MDT up reply actions
agreed
there was a stint while chris bosh was injured in toronto last season when graham was playing well. in most aspects (points boards fg%) i still like balkman better. especially if balkman has worked on his J. cos from where i’m standing, that’s the only thing graham has over naldo. a jumper. i mean, graham doesn’t need to be covered all the time. but if you leave him too wide open, he’ll make you pay. balk on the other hand, well defenders will leave him without a thought of him on their minds.
I think the Nuggets will keep 14 players for now, and then cut one of them free in January before their contract becomes guaranteed. Just a hunch. Provides some extra insurance for the first couple months of the season without breaking the bank.
Very good point and I agree. Have to keep somebody around while J.R. is out.
Denver Stiffs.com: Defending the sovereignty of Nuggets Nation.
by Nate Timmons on Oct 16, 2009 9:42 AM MDT up reply actions
For what it’s worth, I don’t know if I’m the only guy who noticed or what, but during the game in Taiwan; Graham put two hands in a guys back and shoved him to the floor trying to get a rebound that Melo wound up getting. There was no foul called. The next time down Graham does the same thing and a foul was called on him. Seems to me that says that Graham isn’t afraid to get rough and that he’s going to get his money’s worth on fouls. It also seems to me that the replacement officials are learning.
by Thursty on Oct 16, 2009 10:39 AM MDT reply actions 1 recs
"Flexibility"
Seems to me this gives Wark a great deal of flexibility in trade terms. Petro and XXX for a better big perhaps.
Sounds good on paper, but the only issue is that Petro was a completely unrestricted free agent and not one team made an offer to him, so he re-signed with the Nuggets for the minimum. So I don’t see why anyone now would trade for him when he was available all summer for (NBA) cheap. But maybe we could trick our trading partner Pistons into some kind of crazy deal again.
trade exception
denver has 2- one for 3.5 million and one for 10 million. they can use petro’s numbers with a trade exception then the other team can cut him and his nongaurunteed deal.
pick up a calf every day pretty soon you will be picking up a cow
So, BrianD, do you think that Joe D will go crazy and give us their 2010 first-rounder for Petro?
Realistically, he’s here to stay. I still definitely would have taken Pops over Petro. AT least Pops can shoot somewhere near 50% and not suck at catching the ball.
"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." -John Elway
I'm glad that we have another Balkman
When I hear that Grahm is similar to Balkman, it only makes me happier. You can’t have enough of those guys on a team imo. Those guys are the types that make the heart and soul of a team. I think Grahm is going to end up being a fan fav here much like Balkman has become and I would love to see them both occupy the court at the same time for stretches just to see what it would be like. I think Grahm, when it’s all said and done, is going to end up being a bigger Dahntay Jones.
by GoldenNugget on Oct 17, 2009 11:15 AM MDT reply actions 1 recs
I MISS EDDIE NAJERA!!!!!!!
"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." -John Elway
I remember somebody saying that...
(Note: I am sorry for not remembering who said this or where they said this. Also, it may be paraphrased).
…“This sucks. Now we have three hard-nosed defenders who can’t shoot in Afflalo, Balkman, and Joey.”
My note to this person is that Afflalo shoots over 40% from teh 3-ball. I’m not sure if that qualifies at “can’t shoot.”
"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." -John Elway
James White before Graham!
C’mon Nugs, roll the dice on White. Way more scoring potential, if the only time he’s seen minutes this preseason is any indication (led team in scoring w/ Anthony, freq trips to line), and just what our bench needs. If he can apply his athletic gifts to D remains to be seen, but I’d love to see the Nugs give him the chance to prove his worth. Certainly more appealing than Graham, who hasn’t blown me away with anything so far this pre-season.
We may see both guys on the roster to start the season ... remember we'll be short a guy with J.R.'s suspension.
Denver Stiffs.com: Defending the sovereignty of Nuggets Nation.
by Nate Timmons on Oct 19, 2009 8:47 AM MDT up reply actions

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