Karl to A.I.: "Don't let the door hit you on the way out"...

by Andrew Feinstein on Nov 18, 2008 12:24 AM MST

I was at a lunch meeting today and ESPN News was on the TV set in the back of the restaurant. Out of the corner of my eye I could see an icon of George Karl on the bottom ticker with what looked to be a quote dissing Allen Iverson's performance during his time in Denver. Not wanting to be rude, I didn't get up to look closer at what ESPN was reporting. So as soon as I got back to my computer, I scoured the web for something, anything, on these quotes and came up empty.

Until now. And it was right in front of my face.

Looking at the Denver Post Nuggets content from yesterday, I stumbled upon this article written by Benjamin Hochman which serves up Karl's recent quotes comparing A.I. to the newly acquired Chauncey Billups. I'm stunned that this hasn't been more widely reported.

Karl's latest, greatest quotes comparing the two players include...

"There are less bad plays, more solid plays. I think the wasteful, cheap possessions that we used to have 10 to 15 a game, they don't exist very much anymore."

...and...

"We have contested-shot charts, bad-shot charts and cheap defensive possessions. I would say that when A.I. was here, we had most games in the teens of contested, tough shots, sometimes in the 20s. And I don't think we've had a double-digit one since (Billups has) been here."

...oh, go on, please...

"I don't think there's any question coaching a team for many minutes, without a passing and point guard mentality, is frustrating for a coach. Sometimes I saw something, but I couldn't get it done on the court because I didn't have a playmaker out there."

Wow. It's as if Karl is trying to out-gaffe Joe Biden.

As usual, Karl lays blame on his team's failure to win more than one playoff game in two seasons with a roster chock full of top draft picks and All-Star caliber players on anyone other than Karl. Karl's players are by no means blameless, but when Karl shares the blame with his players, it will be for the first time.

Furthermore, I don't seem to recall A.I. taking a night off last season while his "coach" regularly did so. There's a reason why Karl finished second-to-last in coaching technicals last season with one.

And even if what Karl said about A.I. is true, what good does it do to say it? What's the point? Why not just take the high road (as A.I. has done since leaving Denver), wish A.I. the best, and move on? Why ruin what's been a great two weeks of the Chauncey Era?

The Nuggets/Pistons January 9th matchup just got infinitely more interesting. I'll be rooting for the Nuggets to win and for A.I. to torch his former "coach" for 50+ points.

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George Karl is a prick. I hope AI comes out and tells everyone how bad a coach he is. The coach is blaming the player. That's so stupid. He's the friggen coach! COACH THE PLAYER YOU DUMMY!

"No real playmaker on the floor" - Why do we need a playmaker anyway. It's not like you run plays.

by andrew fisher on Nov 18, 2008 12:52 AM MST reply actions

And 90% of the time AC was playing point guard when there wasn't 'any real playmaker on the floor".

AI was a shooting guard remember George! That's why AC got 30 minutes a night!

And even with a 'real playmaker' like Chauncey on the floor, AC still manages to get 25 minutes a night. What's the deal with that?

by andrew fisher on Nov 18, 2008 12:59 AM MST reply actions

It's not very classy from a coach to bash your former players, but in this case, what Karl said is essentially true.

Good riddance, AI.

by catalan on Nov 18, 2008 2:27 AM MST reply actions

not to support karn in anyway as i think he is a prick and i absolutly hate his use of the media. But in the article he does say that most of the bad posetion and shot selection is due to A.I. not trusting his teammates here and that Detroit will be better place for A.I. and he will pass more since he will trust them more.
But either way Karl should just concern himself with coaching and not blame A.I. as soon as he is 5-1 without him. Grow up man

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 3:15 AM MST reply actions

But A.I. isn't completely innocent in all the post-trade blitz..: http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/the_sporting_blog/entry/view/14450/allen_iverson_prefers_his_new_teammates

"The game is a lot easier playing with these guys," Iverson said. "They're so unselfish. All they care about is winning. So many guys can do so many things, and they make it much easier for me."

Also, I'm not defending Karl here, but the way he constantly praised Camby, Eddy, or Carter last season in games clearly won by A.I. it's not at all surprising that he would dump on him after he left.

by Enver Thuggets on Nov 18, 2008 5:10 AM MST reply actions

damn Karl are you out of your mind let it go the guy left without making any trouble during he's stay with the nuggets played every game as hard as he could by the way he's not a point guard Karl what about your damnass ac who until now plays like a starter our manu ginobili type what's the deal with ac playing shooting guard and turning the ball over more than once in the fourth quarter and not even mention them after the game like what Karl always do when Jr does the same you know what my Friends and i called ac the general because Karl seems like can't coach without having him playing in the last five minutes of the game or so.

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 5:59 AM MST reply actions

Karl may be a prick, but he's right about AI.

Watching AI dribble around until he broke down the defense and could launch his shot was not my idea of offensive "team" play.

But now Karl has no excuse with Chauncey on the floor. It's official -- he said it.

by Dave on Nov 18, 2008 6:46 AM MST reply actions

This is all on Karl. He's an idiot.

I mean come on, his only offensive gameplan was "Run Isolation Play. Get ball to Melo/AI. Hope shot goes in."

And now he has the gall to say it was AI's fault? Look, I know AI never met a shot he didn't like. We all know that.

But Karl's criticism rings pretty hollow to me. I don't think he even attempted to use what he had in a constructive way.

AI may not have been the best fit, but he was a talented player who played hard every minute of every game.

by Chris C. on Nov 18, 2008 7:10 AM MST reply actions

Karl is right unfortunately. As I said when the trade first went down, with Chauncey, we're no longer a "chicken with it's head cut off" team, and we're now a more traditional, deliberate offense, and better defensively at the point too...

by Eric K on Nov 18, 2008 8:18 AM MST reply actions

Karl is exactly right, but that mean you should (or should be excused for) say it. AI was nothing but great in Denver in the effort and professionalism departments (and Karl did say something to that effect right after the trade - he did everything Karl asked and played his ass off every night...).

And Andrew Fisher is dead on - COACH THE PLAYER! If he does things you don't like, take him out, change the plays, change the system, ADAPT, TRY HARDER. AI's entire career has been a series of failed experiments to get teams deep in the playoffs save the 01 Sixers, not all of that was AI's fault and if Karl didn't like the way things were happening he should have acted on it, not chirped in the media 2 weeks after he's gone. What a douche...

by Eric B on Nov 18, 2008 8:54 AM MST reply actions

Karl is a douche for saying that in the manner and timing in which he did, but he's right... but also Andrew, I wouldn't say he's ruined the post-AI era with the comments though... I don't see that.

by Eric K on Nov 18, 2008 9:16 AM MST reply actions

What is Karl thinking? He is speaking out and expressing an opinion and speaking the truth? We can't have that!?! We need to cover up, be phony, and most importantly protect these grown men and not criticize them (gasp!). Poor AI, criticized by his former coach. And Karl even used statistics to backup his claims. What an idiot.

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 9:17 AM MST reply actions

Fire. George. Karl.

by Kieran on Nov 18, 2008 9:55 AM MST reply actions

Karl's a prick, straight up. It never seems as if he's particularly interested in what his team is doing. The only upside is when they get bumped in the first round, management will have to place the blame where it's belonged all along: right on his egg head.

by keeperdesign on Nov 18, 2008 10:02 AM MST reply actions

Stating the obvious here, not newsworthy Andy....It will be roughly two more weeks until Rip Hamilton goes nuts about AI. AI is a good individual player but he does not make the team a better one. We were a better team prior to his arrival and certainly are better with Billups running the show.

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 10:06 AM MST reply actions

Karl says some real stupid shit during press conferences. I can imagine that carries over to the locker room as well.

That said, I'm happy that he and the Nuggets finally realized that a defensive focus was needed. I don't know how much credit he deserves for this, as we have all known about the awful Nuggets D for a while and would've gladly made an adjustment years ago.

Karl should focus more on not alienating his players (past and present) and simply start "coaching."

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 10:15 AM MST reply actions

Karl should zip it. Though I agree with everything he inferred about AI - and I'm very glad Billups has replaced him - history has shown you can go a hell of a lot further than a first round flame out with AI on your team.

Coach to the talent, fool.

by JTR on Nov 18, 2008 11:57 AM MST reply actions

I don't know, to me this is just Karl being Karl. I don't think he was attacking AI so much as he was expressing how happy he is to have a court leader and point guard. I'm not a huge Karl fan either, but I think this is blowing things out of proportion.

by grantarchy on Nov 18, 2008 12:00 PM MST reply actions

All this comment does is just show how bad a coach Karl really has been during the time AI was here. A good coach can work with any type of player and structure his team around him, like Larry Brown did in Philly. I think the biggest problem was that Melo and AI were too similar in the way they are used on offense. But I blame Karl for silmply just letting AI loose more than anything. I have watched Detroit twice already, once in real life, and it is CLEAR that the coach still has structure in his offense with set plays and rules. Karl should have just shut up because in my opinion he is the one who looks bad.

by Goldennugget on Nov 18, 2008 12:17 PM MST reply actions

" Anonymous said...

What is Karl thinking? He is speaking out and expressing an opinion and speaking the truth? We can't have that!?! We need to cover up, be phony, and most importantly protect these grown men and not criticize them (gasp!). Poor AI, criticized by his former coach. And Karl even used statistics to backup his claims. What an idiot." WELL SAID LOL. All you guys have done on this site is whine about how we didnt have a point guard, and Jr didnt get enough minutes, why did we just give camby away,wah wah wah wah all you do is whine on this site. Well we are 5-1 this season and are looking to be a top 5 seed if we keep this pace, stop your bitching, give some praise for once, and peace im going to a real nuggets blog that gives good insight(pick axe), doesnt just fuckin whine and moan.

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 12:19 PM MST reply actions

^^^^^5-1 since chauncey

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 12:21 PM MST reply actions

"I've always liked to shoot early, but we got irresponsible with it and then it became the only way we could play well," Karl said. "We didn't have the other option. We were too deficient — too many deficient coaching philosophies, too many deficient defensive players, too deficient a defensive commitment. You can blame everything and everybody."

Well, he does take a little blame there......

by danjustin on Nov 18, 2008 1:22 PM MST reply actions

Billups is basically doing Karl's job for him! Sure! Who wouldn't like to go to work, collect a paycheck and not have to lift a finger.

by viracocha303 on Nov 18, 2008 3:59 PM MST reply actions

Karl is an idiot and people who watch the Nuggets know this is true. When AI was with the Nuggets, you know we never lost to the Cavaliers if I might add. However, here's the problem with the dumb stuff that this guy says.
First off Tony Parker is not a shoot-first PG yet he has won 3 championships. Michael Jordan never had a pure PG and he won 6 championships.
The Suns have a pure PG and have never won a championship.
Karl is a bum and it even shows right now. The Nuggets still play one-on-one ball, and still look terrible on offense. One of the big reasons why the Nuggets have been successful is Nene, but no one is talking about a guy who is leading the league in FG%.
The Nuggets still need a better coach and shouldn't be excited about most of the games that they've won that they were supposed to win.

by Anonymous on Nov 18, 2008 4:35 PM MST reply actions

Why the SHOCK???? This is vintage George Karl. In Seattle, it was Gary Payton's fault. In Milwaukee, it was Ray Allen. With the Nuggs, as soon as he's fired, it'll be Melo's fault! The guy NEVER steps up and owns his own incompetence. Granted the AI experiment didn't work out- but why go there? You're playing well, defence is better, team chemistry looks good. Why be a PRICK? Unless of course you have no class, & don't know any other way? Just asking......

by KaiserSoze on Nov 18, 2008 5:01 PM MST reply actions

It would be justice if Phil Jackson was to share some sentiments about Cody. Just to show the asshole he should keep his mouth closed.

by samiam on Nov 18, 2008 6:14 PM MST reply actions

I enjoyed AI here and his passion and determination to win but he was a brick thrower and it has been a good trade so far. What can be said about Karl here that has not been ripped into already. So here is hoping for a better season

by markp on Nov 18, 2008 7:11 PM MST reply actions

Give it a rest, people, Karl didn't say anything beyond the pale; what he said was on the same level as AI's comments since moving to Detroit. Yeah, he'd have been smarter not to give his former star the fuel for next time they meet, but it's not a big deal.

Y'all can call Karl a bad coach here all you want, but the fact is, the Nuggets over the last year or more played like they were barely listening to him. Yeah, a good coach gets his players to listen... but good players listen. From little hints Karl's dropped to the press (and yeah, they are a little self-serving), it took Chauncey to get the team to do what coaching has been telling them to do for years.

by Sean on Nov 18, 2008 9:39 PM MST reply actions

Andrew I think you hit the nail on the head. The AI experiment didnt work, but its completely un professional to make comments like these.I respect you for respecting the effort Allen gave night in and night out. And there is no question that with Chauncey this is now a more conventional team, but with the exception of the victory of Boston all the wins the nugs have had since chaunceys arrival were against garbage teams. That is not a knock on Denver (I am a huge fan) but you cant just say oh now we are so much better because of the record since the trade. Only time will tell with the remainder of the regular season and more importantly in the playoffs how much better they really are.

by Anonymous on Nov 19, 2008 12:44 AM MST reply actions

Karl is a shrewd individual, I'll give him that. I think a lot of people missed the point of his intent. This is just my take, but I'm pretty sure Karl wanted those words to get to A.I. He might know how personally A.I. would take those words and get fired up. The thing is, if A.I. does get "fired up" he'll only prove Karl's point. Karl wants Iverson to show everyone exactly why this was a better trade for Denver, at least in the short term. A.I. on a scoring tear will not help Detroit maintain their team concept. It's a mind game.

by trasoul82 on Nov 19, 2008 4:50 AM MST reply actions

Karl is a hippocrite. When Ai was there Karl couldn't say enough good things about Iverson. Karl said Iverson was better than good. Iverson is the one that led the team to the playoffs despite their injuries and no defense. If they had the newly acquired guys and their big man(NeNe) they still would've made the 2nd round. Iverson went back to Denver and beat Karl's team(lol). He out-played Chauncey and his team.

by sweetroseAIfan on Jun 19, 2009 12:41 PM MDT reply actions

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STIFF LIST (as of 1/30 by Jeff Morton)

1. THE ORLANDO MAGIC
After starting the season so well with the Dwight Howard trade drama (10-3) - the Magic have fallen apart (2-5 since) with embarrassing losses to the Celtics (twice), Hornets, and Pacers. Trade Dwight already!

2. CHAUNCEY BILLUPS' FLOP VS. NUGGETS
In the waning seconds of Sunday's game against the Clippers, Chauncey pulled off an acting performance so good it deserved an Academy Award. If he was still a Nugget we would love it, but he's not. STIFF!

3. JIMMER FREDETTE
Dude, if you are going to take the game-winning shot, at least draw some iron: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNO1goJOruQ

4. GEORGE KARL'S 4TH QUARTER AGAINST THE CLIPPERS
Getting out coached by Vinny Del Negro should be a nice wake-up call. Going away from Gallo. Leaving Al Harrington in. Using Rudy Fernandez at point guard. And going ultra small contributed to the Nuggets loss.

5. JEFF MORTON
For saying that the Nuggets would skimp on payroll and go cheap like the Avalanche. Clearly I was wrong and deserve to be on this Stiff List. I can only hope that the gods of basketball forgive me.

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Karl to A.I.: "Don't let the door hit you on the way out"...

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