Debunking the point guard excuse...

by Andrew Feinstein on Mar 11, 2008 3:56 PM MDT

One of the primary excuses that my detractors and Coach Karl apologists throw at me is that the Nuggets can't possibly win because we don't have a real point guard. That somehow until Allen Iverson has a "pure point guard" playing next to him, the Nuggets aren't going anywhere, regardless of who the coach is. When the term "pure point guard" is thrown around, I assume it's referencing pass-first guards like Chris Paul, Jason Kidd, Deron Williams, Steve Nash, Andre Miller, and so on.

Well, I have this to say to my detractors, Coach George Karl and his successor, Coach Rocky (or whomever it is). To paraphrase from former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld:

You go into games with the point guard you have, not the point guard you might want or wish to have at a later time.

Here's the proof. Of the last 21 NBA Champions, only nine had pure point guards who started, garnered significant minutes and were key to their teams' victories (the Lakers twice with Magic Johnson, Pistons twice with all-time worst person in the NBA Isiah Thomas, Spurs once with former Nugget Avery Johnson and three times with Tony Parker, and the Heat once with - gulp - the combo of Jason Williams/Gary Payton). Three other teams used a hybrid guard system, where neither guard was a "pure point guard" (the Rockets twice with Kenny Smith and free weight thrower Vernon Maxwell, and the Pistons once with former Nugget Chauncey Billups and Rip Hamilton). The other championship teams - Michael Jordan (whom it should be noted was not a former Nugget) and Scottie Pippen's Bulls, and Shaquille O'Neal and Kobe Bryant's Lakers - didn't utilize a "pure point guard" whatsoever.

Even this season a few Western Conference Playoff teams are faring much better than the Nuggets by letting their two-guards with point guard body types play as shoot-first point guards. I'm specifically referring to the Golden State Warriors usage of Baron Davis, and the Houston Rockets usage of Rafer Alston. And no, BD is not a "pure point guard" compared to the names initially mentioned above. Not even close.

With Davis as their starting point guard for virtually the entire season, the Warriors are 2.5 games ahead of the Nuggets and 4.5 games out of first place in the West. However, the Warriors are 2-7 without small forward/shooting guard/fan puncher Stephen Jackson. Even if they went 5-4 in those games, they'd be fighting for the top spot in the West. It should be noted that the Warriors are 11-5 in games in which Davis dishes out at least 10 assists (and two of those losses were during Jackson's absence).

The Rockets, with Alston starting at point guard, have won 19 straight and are 6 games better than the Nuggets, in spite of suffering injuries far more devastating than anything Denver has dealt with. Remarkably, during the 19 game win streak, Alston has dished out at least 10 assists just three times (five times all year), and he hasn't had more than four assists in any of their last three wins.

Referring back to my Rumsfeld-esque quote above, Coach Karl defenders should stop using the "no pure point guard" excuse for being in the Western Conference's ninth spot. Instead, we should all demand that Karl utilize A.I. as the team's full-time point guard (and start J.R. Smith beside him at two-guard). And why not? After all, the Nuggets are only 12-1 in games in which A.I. has 10 or more assists.

(With thanks to reader Chillz for bringing up the A.I. 10 assists = wins issue!)

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Comments

Andrew - I couldn't agree with you more. Your insight is most impressive and your analogy with the GSW is spot on.

I'd also like to point out how funny and smart your other cartoons are.

Keep up the good work.

by StevenBurroughsDominator on Mar 11, 2008 5:11 PM MDT reply actions

In defense, or lack of defense, either way you want to look at it... Alston was hand picked by the Rockets to run their offense. His assist totals may not represent a pure point but there is a clear difference when he controls the offense. True point guards control flow of the game and get others involved not only through assists but through direction. The Nuggets lack a floor leader, plain and simple.

by Tobin on Mar 11, 2008 5:21 PM MDT reply actions

Good Stuff

by shonuff101 on Mar 11, 2008 8:15 PM MDT reply actions

I heard some jo-blow lawyer put this blog together.

by Anonymous on Mar 12, 2008 9:39 AM MDT reply actions

The fact is that coach has gone soft. There is no fire in his eyes or belly. He speaks in a saintly fashion after every game; for him - life has taken an upper hand than the basketball and rightfully it should be like that for him - it is just that we don't want a coach who thinks basketball is just a game. At NBA level where talent levels are almost similar in every team (more or less); a passion to win is what separates from haves and have nots; Look at LeBron, Kobe, Phil Jackson, Avery Johnson -these are the people we will be seeing in playoffs and not tranquil George Karl; dopey AI, a smiling Melo or a droopy Camby.

by Anonymous on Mar 12, 2008 9:47 AM MDT reply actions

Exactly on point. With AI at point you can start a bigger guard in JR. or even Diawara, who incidently has a high win rating when he starts this season. And the combination of AI, Diawara, Melo, Kmart and Camby has our highest rating according to Lenovo stats at 60! Second was AI, JR, Klieza, Camby and Najera at 45. Also there is nothing more unstoppable then having AI bring the rock up because if your not careful and get back on Defense he can get a quick and easy at any moment. Great article!

by chillz on Mar 12, 2008 10:30 AM MDT reply actions

Solid stuff!

by Geerten on Mar 12, 2008 10:41 AM MDT reply actions

its not the fact that we dont have a point guard. the fact is Karl is a retard who doesn't start the 5 best players aka JR. AC should be coming off the bench. im sorry AC is a backup at best. however king George has been starting AC every game of the season. gee i wonder how many more games we would've won if JR was starting. damn Karl get over your stupid ego and start JR!

by mr.bobbysteels on Mar 12, 2008 11:01 AM MDT reply actions

I'm only pointing it out because you've incorrectly stated GSW's opening record more than once after your initial post with a guess of 0-8. They went 1-6 to start the season during Jackson's seven game suspension, and 1-1 in games without him since.

Keep the posts coming!

by Shane on Mar 12, 2008 11:02 AM MDT reply actions

Hi Shane,

Another reader pointed out this error and I have fixed it. When I wrote my post yesterday, I was using Baron Davis' game log for the data and mis-assumed that Jackson was suspended for the first 5 games (in which GSW went 0-5) and then missed 3 other games due to injury. When in fact, Jackson was suspended for 6 games (in which GSW went 1-5), and then missed two to injury (not three) and GSW went 1-1 as you have pointed out.

Here is Jackson's game log for anyone who doesn't believe me:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3210/gamelog;_ylt=AtA6pcUMjjeZ1HPdGwYk4omkvLYF

My apologies for the error, but it is corrected now. Thanks for reading so closely!

All best,

Andrew

by denverstiffs@gmail.com on Mar 12, 2008 11:09 AM MDT reply actions

No "pure" PG is a BS excuse... But over-playing Anthony Carter has no excuse. He shouldn't be logging as many minutes as he does, plain and simple. Karl doesn't play JR though because he thinks he has too many lapses in judgement. I can't totally disagree with that at this point in JR's career because I'm not 100% confident that he's going to consistently bring the ball up the court and make the best decision every time, but the minutes need to get balanced out there big time. And did you see JR take on the Spurs Monday? He scored at will, not pulling up for 3's but knifing thru the trees and scoring layups/dunks. He's an incredible talent, he's always playing the consumate fan when he's on the bench and Karl doesn't see it because he's too busy looking at Rocky shoot backwards half court shots and sucking on Now N Laters.

In watching the Spurs game it dawned on me that JR Smith is Manu Ginobli PLUS Tony Parker! Am I wrong? He can create shots, spread the floor, plays great D (when he wants to - which is a problem), pass with the best of them and ignite the home crowd with electrifying plays. PS, why is he never in the dunk competetion?

by Eric K on Mar 12, 2008 11:12 AM MDT reply actions

Further, can we have some sort of spotlight on the good/bad of JR Smith? I love the guy personally. I love too that it seems that every time the cameras cut to him on the bench as they lead into a time out, he's always up clapping and hi-fiving. And all the while, don't you get the sense that when he's standing up clapping and nodding his head trying to rally the troops when it's the Nuggets calling the time out to stop the bleeding of an opposing team making a 10-0 run on us, he's sort of got this "Efff You" vibe you can see in him directed at Karl for letting his formidable years be wasted riding pine so we can play Anthony Carter and now Chucky Atkins?

He's doing all the right things as a teammate don't you think? He needs credit for this.

by Eric K on Mar 12, 2008 11:19 AM MDT reply actions

****ANOTHER CORRECTION!****

Just to prove I'm not totally crazy, Yahoo Sports is missing a game on Stephen Jackson's game log. He was actually suspended for 7 games, including the first 6 in which GSW went 0-6 (as I originally assumed). BUT his game log on Yahoo doesn't account for the Nov. 8th game against Dallas that GSW lost. SO - officially - Jackson has missed 9 games (7 to suspension, 2 to injury) and GSW is 2-7 in those games. I maintain that had Jackson been in all those games, the Warriors go at least 5-4and be contending for a top-4 playoff spot. Sorry for the confusion everyone, but we can blame Yahoo (and me) for this one...

-Andrew

by denverstiffs@gmail.com on Mar 12, 2008 11:20 AM MDT reply actions

In watching the Spurs game it dawned on me that JR Smith is Manu Ginobli PLUS Tony Parker! Am I wrong?

You are ^^

by Iverson Warrior on Mar 12, 2008 1:05 PM MDT reply actions

JR isn't Manu yet. He could be if given game experience. Karl harps on his turnovers and bone head plays, but what about the 2 or three bonehead passes and drives AC does each game!? I respect the hustle AC bring but he should be on the bench. For JR to have a 3 pt stroke... A handle... Unbelievable athleticism... He could be a main staple to this team starting next to AI and Melo. Karl is doing them such a diservice not having more lob, backdoor and pick n roll plays in his arsenal. How could you consistantly stop melo's mid range game in a pick and pop situation? How about JR slashing and finishing? This team has so many options its a shame.

by chillz on Mar 12, 2008 1:36 PM MDT reply actions

I love the site and you're postings but I have to argue with your comments on the Chicago Bulls in 1990's. The first three championships the Bulls used B.J. Armstrong and John Paxson as point guards with Scottie Pippen really only bringing up the ball occaisionally. Pippen definitely was more of a ball handler during the second three championships

by Mike D on Mar 12, 2008 2:59 PM MDT reply actions

B.J. Armstrong and John Paxson. Were their Point guards on paper but they were primarily used as jump shooters within the triangle offense. They never created shots for the team or led the team in assists... They were nothing like Kidd, Nash, stockton.... Even Tony Parker is not a traditional PG. Which is why his assists are never as high as even Allen Iversons. And the spurs have won multiple rings... Derrick Fisher was a serviceable PG for the Laker during their three-peat but he was used just like BJ and Paxson, as a spot up shooter and roll player (Career Assist Average of 3.2 Per game). Billups is NOT a traditional PG at 5.5 apg for his career. He is a score first PG. The Heat darn sure didn't have a pure point and they won a ring... Thats over 10 championships with no pure point on the floor...

BJ. 3.3 APG (Career)
Paxson 3.6 APG (Career)

by chillz on Mar 12, 2008 4:22 PM MDT reply actions

I'm not saying they need a "pure" point guard, I'm saying they need a "good" point guard. You generally need five decent started to contend, and we have 4. Not that Chucky is a superstar, but why he hasn't seen action in weeks is absolutely beyond comprehension, and is reason enough to fire Karl.

by kenoshakid on Apr 1, 2008 1:49 PM MDT reply actions

Comments For This Post Are Closed

STIFF LIST (as of 4/26 by Andrew Feinstein)

1. METTA WORLD PEACE

Metta resorted back to Ron Ron last Sunday by clubbing James Hardenwith an "inadvertent celebratory elbow", landing him a 7-game suspension. Apparently, changing his name didn't prevent NBA commissioner David Stern from overlooking Metta's past behavior problems.

2. CHARLOTTE BOBCATS

The 'Cats are on the verge of securing the worst winning percentage in NBA history. Given that the guy who runs the team - Michael Jordan - had previously drafted Kwame Brown and Adam Morrison, should this really be a shock?

3. OKLAHOMA CITY THUNDER
The team that was supposedly built to overcome the lockout-shortened season managed to lose 7 of its last 14 games, ceding the Western Conference's 1-seed to the Spurs in the process. Their reward might be a first round matchup with defending champion Dallas.

4. BILLY HUNTER AND DEREK FISHER

With report after report coming out about NBPA union head Hunter's shady, nepotistic dealings and questions arising about Fisher's own role in dealing with NBA owners behind Hunter's back during the lockout, this off-the-court scandal could prove to be more exciting than the playoffs themselves!

5. STEVE NASH AND THE PHOENIX SUNS
The Suns are on this list for squandering the last few great seasons from Nash. Nash is on this list for his stupidly stubborn loyalty to a franchise as awful as the Suns.